DG45FC looks promising for HTPC

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soa
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Post by soa » Wed Aug 20, 2008 6:53 pm

Ashex wrote:I'll have more accurate temps in a minute, it's been running for a couple hours. Did you ever have mystery artifacts show up causing the board to shut itself off? I keep getting that while trying to install XP.
No :? .

Maybe the problem will be solved after installing the graphic drivers.

Thanks for the temperatures.

Ashex
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Post by Ashex » Wed Aug 20, 2008 8:34 pm

I think I figured it out. The board configured my ram to run at 667Mhz at 4-4-4-15.
Should have been 800Mhz at 5-5-5-10.

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Fri Aug 22, 2008 4:37 am

I have this set up with a Celeron 440. A couple of quick notes:

DDR2/553MHz memory doesnt work; the board gives 3 long beeps indicating some memory error. DDR2/800MHz works fine.

DVI output does not work; HDMI does. With DVI connected to a computer monitor, I heard a single short beep but saw no video. I wasted a couple of hours trying to figure out what the single beep code was, but was not able to find an anwer. It turned out it's a normal beep after a successful POST.

The Celeron 440's stock fan is a 3-pin fan, and cannot be speed-controled by the BIOS. It's very noisy at the 2200rpm full speed reported by BIOS.

I put together the system with a standard 3.5" drive, 1GB 800MHz RAM in the Casetronic/Morex 2699 case powered by a 60W brick. The system can play 1080i and 720p MPGE2 HDTV recordings without any issue. The power consumption is 40W idle, about 50W playing the said recordings. I have not tried VC1/H.264 videos yet.

With the help of Fanmate if I reduced the speed of the fan to minimum and the system is silent. Both the NB heatsink and CPU heatsink get really hot, but the system runs stable nonetheless. With the Fanmate set half way, the CPU heatsink feels much cooler, but at the expense of increased noise level. The NB heatsink stays hot since it's not getting much ambient cooling from the CPU fan.

Interesting observation: The system's power consumption drops from 50W to 40W after playing a video clip. Apparently this is due to limited power management built into Celeron (i.e. it's not EIST). However, if I simply pause the recording during playback, the power consumption stays at 50W.

Finally, CPUZ cannot read the vcore of the Celeron 440 and shows it as 0.018 or something like that. CrystalCPUID doesn't have any multiplier/voltage control either (not surprising considering the Celeron doesn't support EIST).

I'm please with the initial results. I got what I always wanted: a really small form factor set-top box that's capable of playing HDTV recordings.

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Sun Aug 24, 2008 2:23 pm

A couple more notes:

While the CPU runs pretty cool even with minimal cooling from the stock fan (controlled to spin at ~1100rpm using Fanmate since it has only 3 pins), the NB heatsink is burning hot. But as long as the system is stable I'm not going to do anything about it for the time being.

When playing 1080i/720p HDTV mpeg2 recordings, the CPU usage is around 50-63% with the single core Celeron 440. So the Celeron can comfortably handle this type of video. I tried playing Blu-Ray from disc in XP using PDVD7 but had no luck. PDVD reported that the GPU did not meet the hardware requirements. If anyone is able to play back BD please post your configs/settings (I already tried the BIOS PAVP Disabled/Lite/Paranoid settings). Also, PDVD did not show any HA for AVCHD files. By comparison, PDVD7 had HA for BD and AVCHD for 780G using ATI Avivo.

If anyone is thinking of using the Morex 2699 case just be aware that the front panel USB cable is too short to reach the DG45FC's header.

Finally, if you are running with a C2D I'd be interested to know if CrystalCPUID works on this board since it doesn't have voltage and frequency controls in the BIOS.

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Tue Aug 26, 2008 7:10 pm

I installed Vista and started to see the benefits of hardware acceleration promised by the X4500HD. I think the reason I didn't see any HA in XP was that the Intel driver did not support it. The current version of the driver for Vista is 15.9.9.1527 whereas for XP it is 14.34.5.4973.

In Vista, 16mbps AVCHD 1080i hi-def camcorder recordings registered 40-60% CPU usage when played back using PDVD7. In XP the CPU pegged at 100%.

I tried playing a few BR movies using PDVD7. "Mission Impossible 3" (an mpeg2 title) played back with occasional stuttering. The CPU usage averaged around 95%. Same for "300" and "Planet Earth" (both VC1 encodings). PDVD7 choked badly on "Pirates of the Caribbean - At World's End"; it behaved as if there was no hardware acceleration. The CPU pegged at 100% all the time.

Keep in mind all the results were based on a lowly single core Celeron 440 @ 2ghz.

Ashex
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Post by Ashex » Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:14 pm

Has anyone had luck setting a custom resolution for theirs? I've been trying with dtdcalc and haven't had any luck.

Also, I'm using a laptop drive, and it makes this ominous clicking sound when the board is powering on or half-on.

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Wed Aug 27, 2008 2:56 am

As I mentioned the NB heatsink runs really hot to the touch. This is true even when idle. If you are concerned about the high temperature and plan on adding a NB fan, just be aware that there's only one fan header on this mobo for the case fan. If you use that for the NB fan, you will have to use a case fan that uses the 4-pin Molex power connector, or get some kind of Molex to 3-pin adapter. Or rig your own splitter/adapter. I just let the heatsink get hot and used the 3-pin header for a 50mm case fan downvolted with Fanmate to the point of silence.

One more piece of info on hardware acceleration: With HA my "benchmark" h264 video clip (http://www.elecard.biz/clips/mp4/misc/FCL_1080p.mp4) registered an unbelievable 20% on CPU usage when played back with TMT (PDVD7 showed a blank screen for some reason). By comparsion, my old AMD 690G (no vc1/h264 HA) system with an X2 2.1ghz dual core clocked in at nearly 95% CPU to play this clip.

So far I'm really impressed with this board. My major complaints are:
  • 1. High idle power consumption when compared to a underclocked AMD based system. The higher idle power draw could be due to 3 factors: a. the inability to underclock/undervolt in BIOS; b. my use of the Celeron without EIST; c. the hot NB, a sure sign a lot of power goes to it.

    2. No working driver for XP.

lowpowercomputing
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Post by lowpowercomputing » Thu Aug 28, 2008 12:24 am

@Ashex
Have you had any more graphical issues yet or have they been fixed by correcting the RAM timings? I suppose the BIOS has options for that.

@Ashex & frank2003
You said you can't get the DVI port to work. Is this still the case? I ask because I consider getting this board (I prefer small systems, that's why I consider mini-ITX) and I have a DVI screen which I don't want to give up. Do you know (or can you test) if a HDMI-to-DVI adaptor works and gives access to all resolutions (I need 1680x1050)? My display works fine with a GMA950 via DVI.

@frank2003
What type of RAM do you have?

Muzza
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Post by Muzza » Thu Aug 28, 2008 1:58 am

Can anyone who has this board tell me if its BIOS supports Intel VT.

Thinking on getting one with an E8400 to use as my main PC. I want to play around with some other OS's so having some hardware virtualisation support could be handy.

jstyles
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Post by jstyles » Thu Aug 28, 2008 9:02 am

Muzza wrote:Can anyone who has this board tell me if its BIOS supports Intel VT.

Thinking on getting one with an E8400 to use as my main PC. I want to play around with some other OS's so having some hardware virtualisation support could be handy.

I have a E8300 installed in this board and it has an option for VT.

Just beware that the board's ICH runs 80-90 C and the video drivers are not what I would call production ready.

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Fri Aug 29, 2008 4:08 am

lowpowercomputing -

I have not tried connecting to a PC monitor again using the DVI port. I could have a bad DVI cable or DVI port. I will borrow a cable from a friend over the weekend and try again. But HDMI (on DG45FC) to DVI (on PC monitor) worked, though.

As far as memory goes, I am using two sticks of Corsair CM2X1024-6400 G. The timings on the label are: 5-5-5-12. With just one stick I had no issues. But with two sticks I would sometimes get corrupted video with using PDVD or TMT and would get a blue screen. After swapping the memory slots the problem went away. That was kinda weird, since the two sticks were purchased as a matched pair.

lowpowercomputing
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Post by lowpowercomputing » Fri Aug 29, 2008 5:22 am

frank2003:

Thanks for the info. If you could try with another cable, that would be great. If HDMI-to-DVI works it's not that much of a biggie though. Which resolution were you using? As for the memory, do you currently have two sticks installed and working fine just by swapping them in the slots?

Ashex
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Post by Ashex » Fri Aug 29, 2008 7:01 am

lowpowercomputing wrote:@Ashex
Have you had any more graphical issues yet or have they been fixed by correcting the RAM timings? I suppose the BIOS has options for that.

@Ashex & frank2003
You said you can't get the DVI port to work. Is this still the case? I ask because I consider getting this board (I prefer small systems, that's why I consider mini-ITX) and I have a DVI screen which I don't want to give up. Do you know (or can you test) if a HDMI-to-DVI adaptor works and gives access to all resolutions (I need 1680x1050)? My display works fine with a GMA950 via DVI.

The issues I was having were fixed by setting the timing/speed manually in the bios. As for the DVI issue, it was a conflict with my monitor/board. It worked fine on a dell lcd at work but not on my niko lcd. What monitor do you have? If it's a a bigger name, you should be fine.
I'm considering getting an hdmi to dvi cable since I've been having issues with hdmi-hdmi with my tv.

lowpowercomputing
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Post by lowpowercomputing » Fri Aug 29, 2008 7:56 am

@Ashex
I have an Apple Cinema Display. Thanks for telling me that it worked with a Dell monitor, however I'm still insecure as frank2003 said he's having issues with DVI as well.

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Fri Aug 29, 2008 5:22 pm

I think I bricked my mobo.

In the BIOS I saw that the memory clock was incorrectly set to 766MHz (I think) in auto mode. So I changed it to the 800MHz to match my two memory sticks' speed.

Bad mistake. Now the board won't POST. If I remove the memory sticks the board gives off 3 long beeps indicating no/bad memory; this is expected. But as soon as I populate any/both memory slots the board won't POST. It appears the BIOS still has the new, non-working memory settings in the CMOS. When power is first turned on, the CPU and case fans spontaneously power on and then off. The cycle repeats itself over and over. When the cycle begins I can hear 3 quick faint clicks.

I tried clearing the CMOS by removing the battery and the BIOS jumper. I waited an hour and tried again. No joy.

Does anyone know how to bring the BIOS/CMOS settings back to factory settings on this Intel board?

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Fri Aug 29, 2008 5:34 pm

lowpowercomputing -

When my memory worked, I had both slots populated. However, I now have a brick on my hands after I changed the memory settings in the BIOS.

As for screen resolution: My resolution was automatically set to 1920x1080p when I first connected to my HDTV. When I switched to a Dell monitor (1600x1200 resolution), the desktop was letterboxed. I think this was due to the default settings in the Intel video driver to maintain aspect ratio (16:9). I didn't try to change the resolution on the Dell monitor. But there was no under/overscanning. My guess is that the board should have no problem driving the monitor at its max resolution of 1600x1200.

jOcKeL
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Post by jOcKeL » Sat Aug 30, 2008 5:45 am

soa wrote:
Ashex wrote: What heatsink do you have on yours? That looks like a passive VGA cooler to me :shock:
CPU: Coolermaster Gemini II
NB: Enzotech CNBR1
SB: Enzotech CNBS1 (A little bit cutted on its border with a dremel because it was too big :D )

Image
The Enzotech Coolers look great. I use the CNB-S1 on the NB and the CNB-S1L on the SB.

I can undervolt my E8400 to 1,15V with CrystalCPUID. Does anyone try this with a E7200? May be I will change the CPU.

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Sat Aug 30, 2008 7:16 am

I'm convinced this board still has the bad memory settings in some kind of non-volatile memory that cannot be cleared with the CMOS reset procedure outlined by Intel (i.e. remove power supply and battery for 15-30 minutes).

Why doesn't Intel support explicit CMOS reset like all other mobo makers, where you leave the battery on and short two CMOS reset jumper pins?!

Anyway, I'm not going to waste any more time on this mobo. I will be RMA'ing it next week.

So a word of caution: Don't mess with the memory settings in the BIOS!

lowpowercomputing
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Post by lowpowercomputing » Sat Aug 30, 2008 8:27 am

@frank2003

That sounds odd. Normally, a CMOS reset should fix/undo any "insane" BIOS settings and reset them to known-good defaults. Have you tried putting the "CMOS Configuration" jumper into the 2-3 position and booting up? That's intended for clearing passwords, but maybe it'll work. If it doesn't, can you try a BIOS recovery procedure as outlined in the manual?

It seems this board may still need some time to mature. Not sure I'm still considering it. Wondering if the mATX brother (DG45ID) is more mature.

Tak
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Post by Tak » Sat Aug 30, 2008 10:58 am

frank2003,

Before you RMA the board, try doing a BIOS recovery update.

http://support.intel.com/support/mother ... 023360.htm

It requires a special jumper to be removed to allow the update from CD. Location of the jumper is in the technical spec PDF:
http://www.intel.com/support/motherboar ... 029159.htm

With any luck it should restore the BIOS settings to default as part of the process.

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Sun Aug 31, 2008 6:47 am

lowpowercomputing/Tak -

Thanks for your suggestions. I had already tried the BIOS recovery from bootable USB thumbdrive procedure with no luck. I didn't bother with the recovery from CDROM since the 4-pin Molex never received any power - the system power did not stay long enough for the drive to receive power or signal even if I used an external USB drive.

I've done some research and this appears to be a common problem with the G45 based boards. See other reports on the DG45FC's mATX cousin, the G45ID:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthre ... st14492548
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthre ... st14532859

I'm repeating my warning: Do NOT mess with the memory paramters in the BIOS, or risk bricking your mobo. I think this mobo is not ready for prime time. Maybe Intel should have waited until mid September to release it so that all the bugs, including this serious one, are fixed.

jcuesico
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DF45FC and PicoPSU

Post by jcuesico » Tue Sep 02, 2008 10:08 am

Hello everyone,

I was looking at this mobo for my next HTPC project. I am thinking pairing this with an Intel E7200 C2D, a picoPSU 120W, and a laptop HDD. It won't have any optical drive.

I planning on using it as a Media center "extender." It will only be used to playback recorded TV, movies, videos off the Media Center "Server"

Do you think the above combination would work?

Thanks,

-Josef

frank2003
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Re: DF45FC and PicoPSU

Post by frank2003 » Tue Sep 02, 2008 11:50 am

jcuesico wrote: I planning on using it as a Media center "extender." It will only be used to playback recorded TV, movies, videos off the Media Center "Server"
If you are interested in only a media extender solution and don't care much about future expansions offered by a full-blown PC, may I suggest the following:

http://www.tvix.co.kr/Eng/products/HDM6500A.aspx
http://www.ziova.com/cs615.php
http://www.popcornhour.com/onlinestore (A-110: ready-to-use; B-110: mobo only)

I think any one of the above should meet your needs perfectly. And at ultra low power consumption (~25W, as I recall) to boot.

jcuesico
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Re: DF45FC and PicoPSU

Post by jcuesico » Tue Sep 02, 2008 12:49 pm

frank2003 wrote:
If you are interested in only a media extender solution and don't care much about future expansions offered by a full-blown PC, may I suggest the following:

http://www.tvix.co.kr/Eng/products/HDM6500A.aspx
http://www.ziova.com/cs615.php
http://www.popcornhour.com/onlinestore (A-110: ready-to-use; B-110: mobo only)

I think any one of the above should meet your needs perfectly. And at ultra low power consumption (~25W, as I recall) to boot.
I'm liking the form factor of the Ziova a lot. I may get one just for myself for use in the home lab.

Unfortunately, my wife wants the same Vista Media Center UI in the Bedroom as in the Family room. I can't just get a Vista Media Center extender because I've encoded all my 500+ videos in DIVX and the VMC extenders don't support DIVX. :? VMC media extenders also do not support fluid animated movements of their menu. They simply don't replicate the VMC experience 100%. So I'm stuck having to make a Vista PC...

You know what they say... "Happy Wife, Happy Life"

-Josef

Ashex
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Post by Ashex » Tue Sep 02, 2008 6:20 pm

After having played with this board for a bit, I'm not recommending this for anyone until Intel fixes the issue with resolution detection. It's a pretty common issue, and DTDcalc is not fixing the issue at all, so unless you know your monitor/tv works with an Intel graphics chipset, avoid this for the time being.

frank2003
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Post by frank2003 » Wed Sep 03, 2008 4:25 am

Intel has a new driver for XP (version 14.36.1.4977, dated 9/1/2008). There's no release note:

http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_ ... l&lang=eng

My mobo is dead and in limbo awaiting an RMA. Maybe someone can test this and determine if the driver now supports hardware acceleration in XP.

Ashex
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Post by Ashex » Thu Sep 04, 2008 7:23 pm

Thanks for the heads up. I updated drivers and still wasn't able to get it above 720x480. I started playing with settings, and reducing the hardware acceleration by two allowed me to pick whatever resolution the card supported. I set it to 1280x720, then tweaked the aspect ratio by dropping both to 60 and it now looks somewhat decent. Haven't tried video playback yet, but I assume it won't be good since I disabled part of acceleration.


Edit: Should note that all resolutions I added with DTDcalc did not show up.
Edit Edit: Brought hardware acceleration back to full and it's still at 1280x720

Ashex
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Post by Ashex » Thu Sep 04, 2008 8:11 pm

some interesting stats:


E7200
120GB Laptop drive
picopsu 90W with the 60W brick (will probably upgrade depending on what load draw is)
I haven't connected my dvd drive yet, since I need to get one of those tiny 4 pin molex adapters.

Idle: 30W
Playing 720p video: 36W with CPU at 40%
Playing 1080p video: 42W with CPU at 70%

If it breaks 50 with the dvd drive, I'll definently upgrade the brick.

Muzza
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Post by Muzza » Thu Sep 04, 2008 11:35 pm

So, got my board yesterday, went to install vista (home premium 64 bit), all went fine until i installed the latest graphics drivers.

As soon as they install my monitor goes to no signal.

My monitor is a cheap LG (22ls4r) it has hdmi and d-sub, no dvi connector. I was using a hdmi to hdmi cable.

I got into safe mode, installed vnc, got in and tried messing about with the settings.

A couple of times I managed to get it to display a lower res with 16 bit colour, then work my way up to 1680x1050 and get it to display but on reboot it just does the same goes to "no signal"

I'm going to get a dvi-vga cable today which i'm sure will work, but is not the best combo long term.

Anyone got any ideas?

I've used this monitor happily at 1680x1050 using vga and my xbox uses component with no probs as well.

magho
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Noise from DC/DC-converters

Post by magho » Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:37 am

Hi. I'm running my board with an E7200, 1gig ram and a picopsu-90. No optical or harddrive, I boot it off the network. I was a bit surprised to see that it consumes about 45W when idle (cpu@1596MHz) compared to my AMD and nvidia mATX-boards that are around 30W with the same psu. But my problem is that I hear a high-pitch noise from the DC/DC-converters on the board. First I thought it was from the new picopsu but it was the same when I changed to my old picopsu-80. The sound changes pitch with cpu load and is audible from over 10 feet.
Anyone else having this problem?
/Magnus

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