Time for a new rig

Got a shopping cart of parts that you want opinions on? Get advice from members on your planned or existing system (or upgrade).

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Agathon
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Time for a new rig

Post by Agathon » Sun Jan 19, 2020 1:38 pm

Its been a couple of years since I last updated my PC. Thanks to this forum it served me well ;)

Now its time for an update.
Parameters did not change much. I still hate anything that makes noise in my PC. Still working, still playing games. Dont care much about costs, as I am not updating my computer all the time.

To make up my mind, I do have a couple of questions:
- CPU: For many years there was consensus that Intel was the preferred option. Now I do see AMD chips that may also be interesting, eg: Ryzen 7 3700x, it has a TDP of 65W wich is significantly less compared to its intel counterparts. The 7nm seen to matter. I read a couple of reviews where the real consumption was measured and the 3700x excelled. Do you guys consider AMD these days? Am I missing something?
- GPU: Again looking at the power consumption, I got interested in the Radeon VII. When undervolted it looks like to be a powerful, yet less power consuming card. Problem is that the dba are madness. Some reports say its around 50dba! The modders that I came across try some stunts to make it better, but still looks like to be a hot and loud card. In a couple of places I saw praises for EVGAs cards in general. Can this be confirmed? What is currently the best power to noise card in your opinion?
- RAM: Not much to say here, looks like Corsair is good
- PSU: Had bad luck with my last PSU from Seasonic, it fried by GPU at some point, capacitor went puffff. Have a corsair now. A bit unsure in what W I should go for. I currently think of 750W. Any brand alternatives that come to mind?
- Case: was planning to stick to my current Fractal Design case.
- MB: Did not yet dive into this topic yet, any advise is welcome.

Would be great to hear your advise!

CA_Steve
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by CA_Steve » Sun Jan 19, 2020 4:54 pm

AMD has certainly gotten back in the game. It's worth considering for your build. Note the marketing smoke and mirrors regarding TDP these days from both Intel and AMD. It's best to look at reviews that compare the processors you are interested in with app loads you use and see the actual power usage.

While AMD is using a smaller sized process for their GPUs, Nvidia still has a bit of a lead on fps/W...part dependent. Here's a comparison of the VII vs RTX 2070 Super @ Anandtech's Bench.

When you narrow down the CPU and GPU choice we can chat about PSU sizing. That said, the total system power in the above comparison was 300W under gaming load. So, chances are a 650W class PSU will be quiet while gaming.
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, Asrock Z97 Anniversary, MSI GTX 1660 Gaming X, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic SSR-550FX. 35W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

CA_Steve
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by CA_Steve » Tue Jan 21, 2020 11:53 am

.and then things change. Looks like AMD did a bit of tuning with the 5600 XT. Excellent performance / Watt. Too bad they still didn't resolve the multi-monitor RAM clock power issue.
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, Asrock Z97 Anniversary, MSI GTX 1660 Gaming X, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic SSR-550FX. 35W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Olle P
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Olle P » Fri Jan 31, 2020 6:29 am

I'm all for Ryzen CPUs. Steve's comment on TDP is possibly true for the high end models. I run an R5 3600X which has an official TDP of 95W and it's using a solid 70W at full load.

As for AMD's GPUs they aren't very power efficient when running at their regular factory overclocked speed.
If frequency and voltage is dropped to levels that are more suitable from a technical perspective they become power efficient. That's why for example Vega cards were highly praised by cryptominers a few years ago.
It's really poor price performance to run the cards at that level though.

I suppose a slightly underclocked and undervolted RX 5700X would be a nice buy. Don't know how well Turing cards respond to power reduction.

Agathon
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Agathon » Thu Feb 13, 2020 11:16 am

Thanks for the comments so far. I must confess that my last AMD build was probably over 15 years ago. At that time to find a compatible combination of board, CPU, RAM and GFX was an art on its own.
Are you aware of specific reviews around getting CPU and GPU silent for those new AMD parts? Power consumption is not the only factor I guess. In some reviews I came across so far you see comments of strange high frequency sounds.

Abula
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Abula » Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:44 pm

CA_Steve wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 11:53 am
Too bad they still didn't resolve the multi-monitor RAM clock power issue.
Nvidia is really nice when you have 2 60hz monitors, but if you have one 144hz the clocks get screwed, if you drop multi monitor you can have a single 144/240 and still downclocks correctly... but in my particular case, what i did was to have my 240hz monitor off unless im playing fps games, and the 4k60 2k60 are the two monitors that i use on the daily basis, but as soon as i introduce a 60+ monitor like 4k120 ill be screwed with the clocks and nvidia, for this i simply think that AMD isnt a bad option.
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Agathon
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Agathon » Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:26 am

Not sure if I understand the issue correctly that you are talking about, can you explain a bit please?
I am running dual screen at all times. Most if the time its just standard work or surfing. I dont play intensive FPS games these days anymore. The 2 screens are from the same type and brand (Dells).

CA_Steve
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by CA_Steve » Sun Feb 23, 2020 7:10 am

From that same 5600 XT review. AMD's card keep the RAM clock running at rated speed rather than downclocking to the few hundreds of MHz when there's more than one monitor connected. Nvidia's cards do - except for the case Abula mentioned.

In your use case, an AMD card would use 18 to 36W for general web browsing and other 2D tasks while an Nvidia card would use 5 to 21W (all depending on which card in the stack you get...).
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, Asrock Z97 Anniversary, MSI GTX 1660 Gaming X, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic SSR-550FX. 35W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Agathon
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Agathon » Sat Apr 25, 2020 3:49 am

Finally got some time to think about it a bit more (thanks to Covid-19 lol)

For GPU I have so far settled for MSI RTX 2070 Super Gaming X Trio. Reason is that this appears to be a good sweet spot for power to noise. I found a couple of reviews that praise the card as very silent. Some measure it with under 30 dba under load, which I think is very nice.

CPU wise I would choose the Ryzen 7 3700X, 65 TDP, not super expensive like others and overall I think a good idea. I was considering the Ryzen 5 also. During investigations on what motherboard to use, I was shocked to learn that current x570 boards have a chipset fan! Holy cow, I thought after so many years of noisy system fans we are done with this crap by now, but apparently we are not. I hate chipset fans! They are small, of low quality and always cause issues down the road. Often they are also very hard to remove.
So? Apperently there is one x570 board that is passive: Gigabyte X570 Aorus Extreme. But looking at the price I am very skeptical. Probably this is a jack of all trades, I want to do all, motherboard. It has lots of features that I dont want, all of which increase the price. The only thing I want is a passive cooled mainboard.
I saw a modder removing the stock chipset cooler from a x570 board and replace it with a passive heat sink (looks like a baby Noctua), but I could find out what part/model it is and where I could get it. Maybe you have some ideas there?

So, I took a look at the Intel faction. Intel Core i7-9700k cought my eye. Looks like it performs well in single thread tasks due to high base clock. I read a bit about the upcoming generation 10 of Intel (because they seem to have lower power consumption), but as the release date is probably in May and it will take time to reach the end user, I decided I will not wait for it. I was a bit surprised to note a difference between x570 and 1151 v2 boards: PCI 4.0 for M.2 slots.
I investigated on the effective differences of PCIe 4.0 and 3.0, naturally the bus clock is high on the newer 4.0, but in a test that I found the actual loading time of games was not so much different in the end (15-20% faster for 4.0 and not double the speed as I first thought).

I also took a look at the current generation of M.2 drives and I was surprised to see some brands now using rather massive coolers on top. That made me worry about how to fit it in.

My key questions right now are:
- what do you think about x570 boards, how can you make it silent? Is really the expensive flagship gigabyte board the only choice?
- For Intel i7, what boards would you recommend? I would want (min) 2 M.2 ports, excellent networking chip, must be passive (or replace parts to make it passive), I will mount 64GB RAM
- CPU cooler, I found the scythe ninja to be silent, but I thought they are cheating a bit because they limit the max RPM of the fan. So its more silent because it will move less air, so it will ultimately make the system a bit warmer. What would be your choice?
- PSU, didnt get investigate much in that area, advise more than welcome.

Looking forward to your feedback :)

CA_Steve
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by CA_Steve » Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:58 am

Wow, what apps are needing 64GB of RAM?

A couple of things to ponder:
- do you have anything that will make credible use of PCIe 4.0? If not, and going with AMD, consider B450 boards to save some $'s and have passive chipset.
- this year's batch is the last gen of CPUs using AM4 and socket 1151 mobo's for AMD and Intel. So, no CPU upgrade path down the road (unless you backfill with a 1151 i7 for an i5, etc.).

Scythe Ninja continues to be stellar, as are the Mugen and Fuma. From a silence perspective, you really don't want rpm above 800, anyway.

Corsair RMx is a decent PSU. Passive to 30% load(ish). If you like an always on (and generally silent) fan, there's the beQuiet Dark Power Pro 11 and Straight Power 11. Seasonic's Prime series (from titanium efficiency down) also provides passive support to 30% or so load. If you want to spend less, there's the Seasonic Focus Plus Platinum and Gold.
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, Asrock Z97 Anniversary, MSI GTX 1660 Gaming X, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic SSR-550FX. 35W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Agathon
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Agathon » Sat Apr 25, 2020 7:46 am

CA_Steve wrote:
Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:58 am
Wow, what apps are needing 64GB of RAM?
Nothing really, but I use my computer also heavily for work and tend to have A LOT windows open. Right now, without any games and without working I still use 70% of my available 32GB RAM right now. I simply thought: I want an upgrade, so 64 it is :D

Hmm B450, I havent investigated this yet. What would be the downside? Only PCIe 3.0? The only usecase for 4.0 would be the M.2 drives. Do you have specific boards in mind?
AMD will be backward compatible I guess, do you know when the new generations of sockets will appear on the market?

Thank you for the suggestions on PSUs!

CA_Steve
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by CA_Steve » Sat Apr 25, 2020 11:22 am

70% of 32GB used for just desktop and browser tabs still sounds high... I'm running a game atm and have 12 tabs open in two different browsers, and an email client and other little bits going on and am only using 7.3GB out of 16GB. You might go into task manager/performance tab/memory and see what's going on there...

I think Abula is a fan of the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max. (The Max boards have a USB-C front panel connector). There may be a couple of fewer features, notable smaller VRM circuitry as MSI expects OCers to use the X boards. Also, I think I read somewhere that the B550 series (with unknown features) is coming out in maybe June? That said, I recommend waiting 3 months after new mobo series release to let bugs settle/firmware updates to slow down.
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, Asrock Z97 Anniversary, MSI GTX 1660 Gaming X, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic SSR-550FX. 35W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Abula
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Abula » Sun Apr 26, 2020 1:39 pm

Agathon wrote:
Sat Apr 25, 2020 3:49 am
The only thing I want is a passive cooled mainboard.
If you are willing to drop PCIe 4.0, then go with B450 like MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX, great value mobo with decent VRM heatsinks and because its a B450 it has a passive chipset, I have done 3 builds on it one of them a 3900x and all working flawless, if you wish to see more check
HardwareUnboxed Ryzen 9 3950X on Good & Bad B450 Motherboards
GamersNexus - Buildazoid Best Motherboards for AMD Ryzen: R5 3600, R9 3950X & B450, X570, X470

Now remember with AMD memory does have a bigger impact than with intel, since you want 64gb, i would recommend you go with G.SKILL Trident Z Neo (for AMD Ryzen) Series 64GB (4x16GB) 288-Pin RGB DDR4 3600 (PC4 28800) DIMM F4-3600C16Q-64GTZNC, now with the memory being tall, i would recommend to avoid Ninja5, go with Scythe Mugen5 or Fuma2 or Thermalright LGMRT, neither will overlap with the memory so you can populate all 4 slots with tall memory.

Now if you dont want to pay absurd money for the gigabyte but you do want PCIe 4.0 for your m.2.... then wait for B550, apparently AMD found a way to handle PCIe 4.0 different than they did on x570 allowing them to not have a need on a active fan on the chipset, this are all rumors as there is not a single B550 board out... but its very likely that it will be like this, and delay it as much as possible to not canibalize the pricing of the x570, but with intel having the new release soon AMD is preparing to hit Intel harder with Ryzen 3XXX + B550.
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Olle P
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Olle P » Tue Apr 28, 2020 5:40 am

Agathon wrote:
Sat Apr 25, 2020 3:49 am
- what do you think about x570 boards, how can you make it silent?
It's not like back then. In the old days there were 4cm high speed fans that were running constantly to keep the temperature at bay during regular use. Now the fan is bigger and semi passive, only used sparingly if/when the chip is working hard and gets warm.
On my MSI MPG X570 Gaming Plus the fan is running at <500 rpm on average, mostly staying (quiet) below 1,000 rpm. It can speed up and become noisy, and to my recent checks that seems to happen a bit irratic, seemingly at random. Not quite sure I can trust the sensors though, since the fan was running full tilt at 68C (peak) chip temperature on one occasion and then stayed quiet at the same temperature another time.
Replacing the cooler could cause other issues like preventing the use of longish graphics cards.
My comment on this is: - "Your milage may vary." (For me it does so on a day-to-day basis.)

The B450 Tomahawk MAX suggested by Abula is a fine card but doesn't meet your requirement of two M.2 slots.
Asus ROG Strix B450-F (ATX) and MSI B450 Mortar MAX (mATX) are examples of a popular boards that should fill your needs. I can't vouch for them actually being good though, but I wouldn't avoid them as possible options for my own use.

As for PCIe 4 vs 3:
Right now the difference is most notable with Radeon RX 5600XT cards that use a PCIe4 x8 connection to the motherboard. There it's possible to see a slight difference (drop) in framerate if it's connected to a gen 3 slot, when the right (atypical) settings are used.
Future graphics card will likely use gen 4 as well, but the performance difference with x16 connector should be even less apparent.

Agathon
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Agathon » Fri May 01, 2020 2:36 am

Abula wrote:
Sun Apr 26, 2020 1:39 pm
If you are willing to drop PCIe 4.0, then go with B450 like MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX, great value mobo with decent VRM heatsinks and because its a B450 it has a passive chipset, I have done 3 builds on it one of them a 3900x and all working flawless, if you wish to see more check
HardwareUnboxed Ryzen 9 3950X on Good & Bad B450 Motherboards
GamersNexus - Buildazoid Best Motherboards for AMD Ryzen: R5 3600, R9 3950X & B450, X570, X470
Many thanks much appreciated. I will review the links!
Now remember with AMD memory does have a bigger impact than with intel, since you want 64gb, i would recommend you go with G.SKILL Trident Z Neo (for AMD Ryzen) Series 64GB (4x16GB) 288-Pin RGB DDR4 3600 (PC4 28800) DIMM F4-3600C16Q-64GTZNC, now with the memory being tall, i would recommend to avoid Ninja5, go with Scythe Mugen5 or Fuma2 or Thermalright LGMRT, neither will overlap with the memory so you can populate all 4 slots with tall memory.
Apparently 3600 RAM is in most parts better than a little bit more expensive 3733 one, even though that would allow for a better multiplier. I honestly didnt fully get the reasons for it that are explained in some reviews. Looks like the 1:x clock ratio might lead to instability of certain controllers and you need to tweak manually. I will go with your recommendation, thank you.
Now if you dont want to pay absurd money for the gigabyte but you do want PCIe 4.0 for your m.2.... then wait for B550, apparently AMD found a way to handle PCIe 4.0 different than they did on x570 allowing them to not have a need on a active fan on the chipset, this are all rumors as there is not a single B550 board out... but its very likely that it will be like this, and delay it as much as possible to not canibalize the pricing of the x570, but with intel having the new release soon AMD is preparing to hit Intel harder with Ryzen 3XXX + B550.
I think I will have to decide on passive vs PCIe 4.0. You know, waiting for better computer parts in the start leads to you never really finishing a build. :D Often you read news about yet another new component that is announced and you wait more, repeat, repeat :)

Agathon
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Agathon » Fri May 01, 2020 2:40 am

Olle P wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 5:40 am
It's not like back then. In the old days there were 4cm high speed fans that were running constantly to keep the temperature at bay during regular use. Now the fan is bigger and semi passive, only used sparingly if/when the chip is working hard and gets warm.
On my MSI MPG X570 Gaming Plus the fan is running at <500 rpm on average, mostly staying (quiet) below 1,000 rpm. It can speed up and become noisy, and to my recent checks that seems to happen a bit irratic, seemingly at random. Not quite sure I can trust the sensors though, since the fan was running full tilt at 68C (peak) chip temperature on one occasion and then stayed quiet at the same temperature another time.
Replacing the cooler could cause other issues like preventing the use of longish graphics cards.
My comment on this is: - "Your milage may vary." (For me it does so on a day-to-day basis.)
I am relived to read this. <500 sounds like you will for the most part not hear it.
The B450 Tomahawk MAX suggested by Abula is a fine card but doesn't meet your requirement of two M.2 slots.
Asus ROG Strix B450-F (ATX) and MSI B450 Mortar MAX (mATX) are examples of a popular boards that should fill your needs. I can't vouch for them actually being good though, but I wouldn't avoid them as possible options for my own use.
Thank you, I will investigate your suggestion in detail.
As for PCIe 4 vs 3:
Right now the difference is most notable with Radeon RX 5600XT cards that use a PCIe4 x8 connection to the motherboard. There it's possible to see a slight difference (drop) in framerate if it's connected to a gen 3 slot, when the right (atypical) settings are used.
Future graphics card will likely use gen 4 as well, but the performance difference with x16 connector should be even less apparent.
And for the M.2 it makes a little bit of a difference i guess. Not as significant as I first thought it would though.

CA_Steve
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by CA_Steve » Fri May 01, 2020 5:38 am

AMD announced B550 will release June 16. That said, my recommendation is to wait until August or September to buy it as there are always high levels of firmware updates/bug fixes/memory controller tuning in the first few months.
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, Asrock Z97 Anniversary, MSI GTX 1660 Gaming X, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic SSR-550FX. 35W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Abula
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Abula » Fri May 01, 2020 6:06 am

Apparently 3600 RAM is in most parts better than a little bit more expensive 3733 one, even though that would allow for a better multiplier. I honestly didnt fully get the reasons for it that are explained in some reviews. Looks like the 1:x clock ratio might lead to instability of certain controllers and you need to tweak manually. I will go with your recommendation, thank you.
There is better memory than what i suggested... but becomes very expensive for marginal gain, also its not that easy to find 3600CL16 64gb, here is a couple of examples of very high end memory for Ryzen,
CORSAIR Vengeance LPX 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 3600 (PC4 28800) Desktop Memory Model CMK16GX4M2Z3600C14
G.SKILL Trident Z Neo Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 3600 (PC4 28800) Desktop Memory Model F4-3600C14Q-32GTZNB

You could take your chances and simply look for Samsung B-die like buildzoid suggests, Is Samsung B-die still in production?, and then manually tune your memory like HardwareUnboxed Steve recommends, How to Manually Tune Your DDR4 Memory For Ryzen, if you wish to see how much do you gain, check 3rd Gen Ryzen DDR4 Memory Performance, XMP vs. Manual Timings. One warning though, remember in memory as with cpus its a lottery so not all chips are equal always, even if its B-Die, better binned chips are more likely to go lower.
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Olle P
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Olle P » Tue May 05, 2020 6:30 am

Abula wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 6:06 am
... There is better memory than what i suggested... but becomes very expensive for marginal gain, also its not that easy to find 3600CL16 64gb, ...
From the tests and reviews I've seen the performance gains of faster memory really start dropping off at speeds above 3.0 GHz
At the same time the cost of RAM increase heavily above 3.2 GHz.
To me it's crystal clear that the sweet spot of price/performance currently sit at 3.2 GHz. If there's a budget limit the added cost of faster memory can be better used elsewhere.

Agathon
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Agathon » Tue May 26, 2020 9:51 am

The rig is completed, and I am still fighting some issues:
CPU, i went for a Ryzen 9 3900x. I observer that the CPU is quickly spiking even in near idle mode, which causes the FANs to go crazy for a couple of seconds. Up - down - up - down, very annoying.
- First of all, the software that came with the motherboard (gigabyte) appears to be complete crap. The monitoring and fan control software appears to be polling the CPU constantly and causes the CPU to spin up all cores and down again to report information. Apart from that, sometimes the apps simply will not load at all. -> after spending some time to try to fix this, I uninstalled all of this.
- I went for a Dark Rock 4 Pro cooler. I have to say, it looks nice and assembling it was easy. However the Fans are an disappointment. After around 800rpm these things have a bit of a a pinched ratteling sound. Normally this would probably not be so much of an issue, because you dont want high spinning fans anyhow. But due to the first problem, this happens all the time. I was thinking of replacing the fans, but turns out the brand I trust (Noctua) does not have a fitting replacement fan. I am considering swapping this thing out for something else.
- The management of the FAN curve over BIOS is ok'ish, but I would prefer some software application. I tested a couple, but I am not very happy with each. ArgusMasters is what I use now, but it has sadly some issues that I was unable to overcome. Any suggestions?
- I did not yet figure out what power management setting under windows is appropriate. AMD chipset drivers install additional profiles for Ryzen for this, but apparently the windows default ones dont make the CPU spin up and down so fast. I came across a thread by AMD about this issue. Its not fixed yet sadly.

Nice things:
- Went again for a fractal design case (the define 7). Very nice manufactured, nice to customize, a little bit more flimsy compared to my old one, not so nice with the installed noise dampening. I think I have to make some additional adjustments (ideas for material to use?).
- I choose a 2070 Super Gaming X card. Even when running 2 games at the same time this card produces nearly 0 audible noise. Very satisfied with this purchase.

CA_Steve
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Re: Time for a new rig

Post by CA_Steve » Tue May 26, 2020 12:15 pm

What motherboard did you end up with?

Inside the BIOS level fan control, there should be a setting for adjusting the hysteresis. If you increase the time it takes to respond, it should even out the up/down stuff without adversely affecting temps.
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, Asrock Z97 Anniversary, MSI GTX 1660 Gaming X, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic SSR-550FX. 35W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Abula
Posts: 3613
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:22 pm
Location: Guatemala

Re: Time for a new rig

Post by Abula » Wed May 27, 2020 5:23 am

Agathon wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:51 am
CPU, i went for a Ryzen 9 3900x. I observer that the CPU is quickly spiking even in near idle mode, which causes the FANs to go crazy for a couple of seconds. Up - down - up - down, very annoying.
- First of all, the software that came with the motherboard (gigabyte) appears to be complete crap. The monitoring and fan control software appears to be polling the CPU constantly and causes the CPU to spin up all cores and down again to report information. Apart from that, sometimes the apps simply will not load at all. -> after spending some time to try to fix this, I uninstalled all of this.
I own Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Master and recently a X570 Aorus Extreme, on the Z390 the only issue that i had is that temps the motherboard monitor for CPU was not the MAX CORE TEMP nor the PACKAGE TEMP, since it had some variations i had to adapt a little more with my bios fan curves but not a big deal, just took more time. From what i have tested on the X570 the temps seem to match the CPU Tclt/Tdie, so setting up the bios fan control should be easier.

I like a little more MSI bios fan control but i find the gigabyte more than adequate to setup the graphs, just have to put the time into booting multiple times and see the behavior under idle/usual/load scenarios to set them up properly.

On Ryzen, my experience is that the CPU spike a lot more than intel, on idle and light load im using 65C as my soaking temp, for this i chose the highest rpm that im willing to take, on my TY147 was 65% PWM for 700rpms aprox, from there the graph grows very steep to try to match 100% for 85C (the highest temp that im comfortable). Give a shot, do your own to your own conditions and uses, take a little time but once you set it up you are very likely never to mess with it.
- The management of the FAN curve over BIOS is ok'ish, but I would prefer some software application. I tested a couple, but I am not very happy with each. ArgusMasters is what I use now, but it has sadly some issues that I was unable to overcome. Any suggestions?
The Argus Monitor is regarded as a good alternative to speedfan, but since you mention you have issues with it, and if the bios fan control is not enough for your needs, then consider an external fan controller like aquaero 6 PRO USB fan controller
Agathon wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:51 am
- I went for a Dark Rock 4 Pro cooler. I have to say, it looks nice and assembling it was easy. However the Fans are an disappointment. After around 800rpm these things have a bit of a a pinched ratteling sound. Normally this would probably not be so much of an issue, because you dont want high spinning fans anyhow. But due to the first problem, this happens all the time. I was thinking of replacing the fans, but turns out the brand I trust (Noctua) does not have a fitting replacement fan. I am considering swapping this thing out for something else.
What memory and motherboard did you buy?
Agathon wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:51 am
- I did not yet figure out what power management setting under windows is appropriate. AMD chipset drivers install additional profiles for Ryzen for this, but apparently the windows default ones dont make the CPU spin up and down so fast. I came across a thread by AMD about this issue. Its not fixed yet sadly.
Im using AMD Ryzen Balanced, but i havent tested that much. There is a new version of windows 10 coming this week (v2004) maybe has this issues worked out. I'm waiting on this update to reformat and test other things to start to move it inside the case.
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